Basecamping Redux

[Paladin]

Ok, this has gotten nuts again. Playing tonight with Stealth on the server, he was kicking people left and right for basecamping (even when their team owned al the flags - a policy I heartily agree with). As soon as he left, basecamping was on again...even without owning all the flags.

Can you please settle on a rule and include it in the rotating server messeges so everyone knows? I prefer no basecamping at all, but that's me, and I'll play according to whatever rules are in place. It's frustrating having the rules change mid-game.

Apologies if I sound bitchy...it's just that the basecamping got a bit out of hand on El Alamein, and of course 73 Easting is always terrible for opponents driving into the enemy base time after time.

[HailtheGoat]

I agree, I had to leave because it turned out to be what I remember of BF. Hurry to the opponents base and spawn camp them. Quite frustrating.

[StealthDP]

I have no problem with a team trying to hold the opposition in its base after all the bases are owned, but they need to do it at a distance, not by spawn killing everyone. On Battleaxe, I was killed six times in a row immediately after spawning. Did not even have a chance to seek cover, or even duck. Gets old pretty fast.

[Paladin]

I have no problem with a team trying to hold the opposition in its base after all the bases are owned, but they need to do it at a distance, not by spawn killing everyone. On Battleaxe, I was killed six times in a row immediately after spawning. Did not even have a chance to seek cover, or even duck. Gets old pretty fast.
I don't know how clear you can make that to people who play on the server but don't ever come here to read the forums, except by kicking them for it of course. If you make a rule that says "stay out of the opponents uncappable base", then you run into a problem when the opposition sees someone in their base and shouts "spawncamper", even if you're only there to grab a vehicle (I ran into this on Bocage once when I ran in to steal a Mig).

As for staying outside the base and "holding" them from a distance... I undertand your point, but I don't see much of a difference from a spawn camping standpoint between the guy that drives a tank around inside the enemy base killing people as they spawn and the guy that fires the Scud across the map into the Allied base on 73 Easting. You're still either dead or berift of vehicles. The same goes for any of the rocket artillery, especially on Kharkov where whichever side gets the central hill with rocket artillery intact can pound the enemy base back to the stone age.

[SoBeiT]

It is very hard to get through to a player who is here only for their personal score that any kind of spawn/base camping is poor sportspersonship. They just don't get it.

Get a number of them on one team and it's a disaster.


I always thought the point of any game was to PLAY. Kind of defeats the whole point of it when you can't live long enough to actually PLAY the game.


Sorry Paladin, I was losing track of what I was doing in game as I was too tired to play and just left. I use TS, so if you can't write it, you can always say it and I'll do what I can to help.

[Salyavin]

My views on spawncamping are pretty well known, so I won't repeat them. :) I'll just say that I like Paladin's idea of putting a rule in the server messages.

Cheers,
Salyavin

[stapuf]

My views on spawncamping are pretty well known, so I won't repeat them. :) I'll just say that I like Paladin's idea of putting a rule in the server messages.

Cheers,
Salyavin

I guess the spawnkamper kids can't read...

GG's tonight.

Amazing how the level of play drops when the forum crowd players leave.

[SoBeiT]

..............Amazing how the level of play drops when the forum crowd players leave.


There is that power of the the "forum crowd".

It does indeed make a difference, plus we hang & play here because we are alike.


Isn't it great we are so "us" :D

:lol:

[Paladin]

There is that power of the the "forum crowd".

It does indeed make a difference, plus we hang & play here because we are alike.


Isn't it great we are so "us" :D

:lol:
There's also the fact that most of the regular players who are in the "forum crowd" are also admins. I think that may have as much of an impact on the quality of players in there with us as anything our actual gameplaying may inspire.

[|Robot|Bender]

Every server i have played on where that is a rule has that on the server messeges. THat will get rid of all questions, HOWEVER...i have heard repedetly over and over that base camping IS acceptible with all flags held. Therefore i rape the base to hell when we hold all flags, but the second we lose one flag, i split.

Its your server, its your rules..:)

[SFT]

I have no problem with a team trying to hold the opposition in its base after all the bases are owned, but they need to do it at a distance, not by spawn killing everyone. On Battleaxe, I was killed six times in a row immediately after spawning. Did not even have a chance to seek cover, or even duck. Gets old pretty fast.

I've been seeing a lot of Sniper spawncamping on Lost Village. They don't even attempt to take the flag. They just sit on the hill or on the building and camp the spawn area. Lost Village is quickly becoming the "Face" map of DC.

[stapuf]

Ask Sparrow about that...

Basically, a coalition guy gets the super sniper rifle, with unlimited ammo (I think), and sits on a hill and snipes.
I don't mind a team member doing that to hold off enemy guys trying to take flags, but these guys usually only spawn snipe. Someone (Opposition) needs to recon and kill the sniper at that point, maybe even the real Recon.

The sniper guys are also teh n00bs that take the helo's without passengers... :D

[Salyavin]

Coalition snipers in the hills don't bother me when I'm on Opp because that's one less assault guy helping take flags in the village. They do annoy me when I'm on Coalition. It's worse when someone on Opp goes around the lake, grabs the sniper kit, and camps the untakeable Coalition flag.

In either case, when I'm on the same team as the sniper I usually ask them to come in to the village and help out. Since I can't see their name from the map, I refer to them by the grid number, i.e. "Hey sniper in D6..." In open chat. :smirk:

Cheers,
Salyavin

[stapuf]

In either case, when I'm on the same team as the sniper I usually ask them to come in to the village and help out. Since I can't see their name from the map, I refer to them by the grid number, i.e. "Hey sniper in D6..." In open chat. :smirk:


I think I got that guy, thanks. :D

[Paladin]

I've been seeing a lot of Sniper spawncamping on Lost Village. They don't even attempt to take the flag. They just sit on the hill or on the building and camp the spawn area. Lost Village is quickly becoming the "Face" map of DC.
Lost Village is easily the map the M82 is best for. It isn't as all powerful as you are making it sound though. It comes with 4 10-round clips. If you manage to live long enough to use them all (unlikely), you will have to go into the village or back to the allied base to resupply. Granted, used well, 40 rounds might seem like unlimited ammo if you are on the receiving end.

When I'm on allies, I almost always get the rifle and head into the hills overlooking the factory flag. I don't see a problem with this for several reasons:

a) If you set up close enough to see a lot of the area around the factory flag, you are close enough to be in plain view of anyone down there. You may get some kills, but you will draw hunters quickly. If you set up far enough out to make it hard for them to see where you are shooting from, you can't see much of an area yourself...part of the rooftop, the bunker and the near side of the garage building. There's no good angle to shoot at anyone laying down next to the flag that isn't going to leave you in plain sight, and the flag can be capped from inside the bunker, completely negating any advantage the Barrett has.

b) The Barrett has a relatively slow reload time. Even someone with the Opposition sniper rifle is going to get off 2 shots to your one, or at least 3 to 2. If they come hunting you (and are dumb enough to let you see them coming), get them with the first shot because you most likely won't get a second.

c) As I've already mentioned, hunting snipers common for Oppostion on that map. If I'm Opposition, the first thing I do is go out in search of a sniper with a Barrett so I can take it. There's always at least one, and since they are usually shooting into the village, they are generally easy to catch off guard (friendly hint: using F11 every once in a while to check out what's coming up behind you is a good thing). Once I have the Barrett, I pull way back and pick off allied snipers who take up position between me and the village.

d) I don't consider using the sniper rifle from a distance to be "spawn camping". If a lot of peope are doing it, maybe you could argue it, but if it's one or two guys...that's what the rifle is there for. I'd be much more worried about spawn campers with mortars or explosive packs, and it's certainly not in the same league as camping IN their base.

[SFT]

I don't consider using the sniper rifle from a distance to be "spawn camping".

I guess you've never played "FACE" in UT.

The other night I was in Lost Village and there were 3 snipers at the end base. I respawned there about 10 times in a row. Each time I was cut down by sniper fire seconds after spawning. I kept trying to make it inside a building, but didn't make it once. That isn't clever use of a sniper rifle. That is spawn camping and it's lame. Oh, but why didn't I respawn somewhere else? I wanted to see to what extent that nonsense would go on and let me tell you it was endless.

If I'm not mistaken the map maker made the Lost Village map to offer some good infantry fighting. Even the helicopter abuse wasn't intended. To consistently play a map exploit takes the fun out of that map and I'd have to say Lost Village is one of those abused maps. I haven't seen a good straight up fight in that map since (DC .4 ???) increased the armor on the Blackhawks. Since then it's gone down hill and all with exploits found in recent releases of DC. First helicopters, now sniper rifles. What next?

The sad thing is I used to look forward to the Lost Village map coming up in the rotation and now I just leave when I see it.

[Paladin]

I guess you've never played "FACE" in UT.

The other night I was in Lost Village and there were 3 snipers at the end base. I respawned there about 10 times in a row. Each time I was cut down by sniper fire seconds after spawning. I kept trying to make it inside a building, but didn't make it once. That isn't clever use of a sniper rifle. That is spawn camping and it's lame. Oh, but why didn't I respawn somewhere else? I wanted to see to what extent that nonsense would go on and let me tell you it was endless.

If I'm not mistaken the map maker made the Lost Village map to offer some good infantry fighting. Even the helicopter abuse wasn't intended. To consistently play a map exploit takes the fun out of that map and I'd have to say Lost Village is one of those abused maps. I haven't seen a good straight up fight in that map since (DC .4 ???) increased the armor on the Blackhawks. Since then it's gone down hill and all with exploits found in recent releases of DC. First helicopters, now sniper rifles. What next?

The sad thing is I used to look forward to the Lost Village map coming up in the rotation and now I just leave when I see it.
RE: Face...yes, I've played it lots. It, and the ones like it, are among my favorites. And yes, I generally aggressively defend my base with the sniper rifle...at least until the 'deemer respawns. And yes, I hate getting spawnkilled too. Half of avoiding that is moving as soon as you spawn, preferably with some jumping thrown in to make the instant kill headshots harder. The other half of avoiding it is dumb luck. There are certainly people out their who are fast enough on the trigger and know exactly where to aim to catch people as they respawn. I'm not one of them, on either count. Nor am I quick enough on the trigger to do much good in close-quarters, unless I'm lucky enough to get behind an unaware enemy. The ability to stay at a safe distance and pick my targets helps to counterbalance my less than perfect reaction time.

I'll be the first to concede that there are players out there who abuse the sniper rifle, but the Barrett isn't as unbalancing as some of the other changes they've made. I personally wish it was more powerful against helos (sorry, I just watched S.W.A.T., where a pair of .50 rifle rounds bring down a helo, but I felt this way before seeing the movie too). Against people, yes it's more likely to score a one shot kill, but not that much more. And if you start out the map with one or two people on anti-sniper duty, you're not as likely to be victimized by them. To ignore the hills and concentrate solely on the close-quarters fighting is inviting trouble. Personnally, I have a much bigger problem with having 2 or 3 miniguns flying over the village and mowing down anything that moves.

[stapuf]

Didn't we all play 'face' alot at first? There are ways around the snipers...

On Lost Village, I love to go after the snipers. Assuming you can get past the first 10 seconds of life alive, you can usually flank them and sometimes get a knife kill :)